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bcollinscrt
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Joined: Feb 24, 2005
Posts: 9
Location: Kansas City

PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 6:01 pm    Post subject: Pulver.com/FWD says Vonage will not cooperate with them Reply with quote Back to top

As of several months ago FWD users (fwd.pulver.com) could call back and forth between Vonage users. This was EXTREMELY handy. Packet8 and other Voip companies also allow this. Vonage a month or so ago blocked FWD users from calling or receiving calls from Vonage users.

Jeff Pulver, founder of FWD, for the most part founded and promoted Voice over IP technology since the mid 1990's. Vonage should KISS HIS FEET and thank him for the technology that has made them so much money.

I talked to a VP at pulver.com this afternoon. They claim that they have tried and tried to get Vonage to open back up their gateway so that Vonage and FWD users may call eachother as "in network" calls.

The VP agreed with me that it is VERY ironic that Vonage is going after different ISPs due to their blocking Voip ports so that their subscribers can't use Voip companies however they won't let FWD users call their customers. This is, frankly, BS.

Vonage is being hypocritical! I'm going to pull my business clients off of Vonage (over 600 lines) in a few weeks if they don't get their act together.

Brian in Kansas City
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dconnor
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 6:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Pulver.com/FWD says Vonage will not cooperate with them Reply with quote Back to top

bcollinscrt wrote:
As of several months ago FWD users (fwd.pulver.com) could call back and forth between Vonage users. This was EXTREMELY handy. Packet8 and other Voip companies also allow this. Vonage a month or so ago blocked FWD users from calling or receiving calls from Vonage users.

Jeff Pulver, founder of FWD, for the most part founded and promoted Voice over IP technology since the mid 1990's. Vonage should KISS HIS FEET and thank him for the technology that has made them so much money.

I talked to a VP at pulver.com this afternoon. They claim that they have tried and tried to get Vonage to open back up their gateway so that Vonage and FWD users may call eachother as "in network" calls.

The VP agreed with me that it is VERY ironic that Vonage is going after different ISPs due to their blocking Voip ports so that their subscribers can't use Voip companies however they won't let FWD users call their customers. This is, frankly, BS.

Vonage is being hypocritical! I'm going to pull my business clients off of Vonage (over 600 lines) in a few weeks if they don't get their act together.

Brian in Kansas City
Telecom Consultant


Everything you say about Mr. Pulver is correct - he is a true pioneer.

Can we cut through the smoke - please?

Correct me if I am wrong. Vonage is not classifying FWD calls as "on Network calls" Correct?

Why should they?

You’re going to pull 600 business lines off of Vonage because of this?

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bcollinscrt
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Yes, I am. Per Jeff Pulver...he invented Voip to be an inclusive community. If you want to call a PSTN (land line) then of course it would be out of network. However, if you wanted to call a FWD user or vice-versa it requires no cost once so ever...no PSTN call is involved. Packet8 and others totally agree. I guess Pulver.com is preparing a press release regarding this matter. It will be very interesting to hear what they have to say. I like Vonage and don't have many problems with them but I always put my money where my mouth is...and in this case yes, I will pull my business clients to make a point. I'll let Jeff, your CEO, know as well (I've spoken with him on several different occasions).

Brian
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scerruti
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Posts: 1424
Location: Carlsbad, CA (finally)

PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

If you search this forum you will find some previous posts written by me arguing that peering with a free service like FWD could create significant problems for Vonage as a company as well as for Vonage users.

One of the scarriest ones, in my opinion, would be free automated SPIT to every possible Vonage SIP address.

If FWD wants to peer with Vonage then they should at a minimum take steps to authenticate users, prevent automated account creation and implement and enforce a strict AUP to mitigate the effects of fraudulent behavior.

As far as it being ironic, I think you are comparing apples and oranges. I do worry about fragmentation of the telephone network, but I think operators should be allowed to set conditions and tariffs for peering just as ISPs do today.

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dconnor
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Posts: 2264
Location: The Beach

PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

bcollinscrt wrote:
Yes, I am. Per Jeff Pulver...

Brian


As the forum admin I am not in a position to debate with you, but I am surprised by your comments. They seem a little grey in the facts dept.

I know the two Jeff's have a long history together, having been told that by both of them. I am sure this will work itself out.

Good Luck to you. Smile

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bcollinscrt
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Location: Kansas City

PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

We actually talked about that...according to the VP at Pulver.com they were authenticating users back and forth. Everything was fine (authentication included) and then Vonage decided they were too big to deal with the little guy. It is NOT apples and oranges. Believe me, I understand exactly what is involved, like the back of my hand. They pulled it because too many overseas users were using FWD to communicate with Vonage users (and other Voip companies).

And yes, Vonage has the right to make their own policies...and so do I. God bless Capitalism.

I am just frustrated. Sorry.

Brian
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sai
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:35 pm    Post subject: Libretel Reply with quote Back to top

Since Vonage does not offer virtual numbers in Brazil, I set one up with Libretel (a Pulver company) using their port-of-call service. Their tec. support guy and I tried to get it to work for two days. When he found out I used Vonage, he explained that their service will not work with Vonage. He immediately credited my credit card for the full setup fee and the first month's charges.

The tech. support guy said that they are starting a list of people who want their system to work with Vonage in an effort to get Vonage to open up.

I would much rather simply have a virtual number in Brazil through Vonage. Does anyone know if this is in the works?

I have been using Vonage for several months now and have never had one single problem. Well, maybe one small one. Occasionally, a call to a cell phone in Brazil will not connect. And I'm saving $75-$100 per month.
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