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winger
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Joined: Aug 12, 2004
Posts: 115

PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2005 5:52 pm    Post subject: pingplotter-packet size AND site Reply with quote Back to top

Need recommendations.
1) What packet size should I set to?
2) What is the best site should I be pinging? Ideally this is a site who is physically closest to the actual Vonage "gateway (where all Voip calls are routed to) ? I was told by Vonage tech that their gateway was unpingable.

Thanks.
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reebok
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Joined: Oct 24, 2004
Posts: 3198
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2005 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

thank goodness it is.
ping anything, shouldn't matter. aren't there ones already in it? just use whatever. yahoo, etc. size doesn't make a huge difference...if they're dropping, they're dropping. there was a big thread about these details a while ago, might find it with a search.

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winger
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Posts: 115

PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2005 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

reebok wrote:
thank goodness it is.
ping anything, shouldn't matter. aren't there ones already in it? just use whatever. yahoo, etc. size doesn't make a huge difference...if they're dropping, they're dropping. there was a big thread about these details a while ago, might find it with a search.
From my observations, it matters what site I ping and matters what packet size I used. I think the concept is if the server is down the block and another is 5000miles away, there tends to be more chances of packet losses for transmissions to/from the 5k site. Also, if I transmit 20k vs. 1200k, the 1200k transmission would likely see more packet loss. Sort of like it is easier to lose 1 sheep if u r herding 1200 sheeps than it is to lose 1 sheep when u r herding 20 sheep...

BTW. whst would u suggest i search on? Give me a hand, I've been down w/ the flu for the past 3 days...
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reebok
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Joined: Oct 24, 2004
Posts: 3198
Location: Lakeland, FL

PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2005 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

haha, ok I'll play that way. here's the deal as I see it. if you're having enough packet loss to show up on pingplotter (at a decent % rate) then it doesn't make a difference any way you cut it. as long as you're not going overseas with the route, staying within north America if that's where you are, then there shouldn't really be any route that causes massive packet loss unless there's a major problem somewhere.

so, if you won't take that as an explanation, here's my understanding of the technical aspect. first of all, what bandwidth saver option and connection do you use? this affects the packet size and overhead. I'll lay it out now because I'm heading to bed after this.
for 90kbps and cable/ethernet, the packet sizes are 218 bytes, then 138 bytes for 50kbps and 78 bytes for 30kbps.
for 90kbps and dsl, it's 265 bytes, 212, 106.
so that's the number you would want to use for size. for a destination, you're looking at trial and error. the ideal way obviously is to ping their servers, but that would be a bad thing, so do this instead. tracert atlas-east.vonage.net or atlas-west.vonage.net (depending if you're closer to east or west...not sure if there are any others) and look at your hops and route. (on another note, it's possible these servers are located in the same place, but they're setup for different halves of the US/world) it won't reach the server obviously, but you'll find out an approx number of hops and the backbone. I'll save you that step, it's alter.net. so find a server with about the same number of hops that eventually hits alter.net. preferably for the same amount of hops through alter.net, because obviously their servers are vital in this. (seems to be about about 6 or 7 through alter.net when you add the fact that the host is unreachable)
so really the hard part is finding a good host to trace/ping to. good luck.

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winger
Vonage Forum Senior
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Joined: Aug 12, 2004
Posts: 115

PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2005 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

reebok wrote:
haha, ok I'll play that way. here's the deal as I see it. if you're having enough packet loss to show up on pingplotter (at a decent % rate) then it doesn't make a difference any way you cut it. as long as you're not going overseas with the route, staying within north America if that's where you are, then there shouldn't really be any route that causes massive packet loss unless there's a major problem somewhere.

so, if you won't take that as an explanation, here's my understanding of the technical aspect. first of all, what bandwidth saver option and connection do you use? this affects the packet size and overhead. I'll lay it out now because I'm heading to bed after this.
for 90kbps and cable/ethernet, the packet sizes are 218 bytes, then 138 bytes for 50kbps and 78 bytes for 30kbps.
for 90kbps and dsl, it's 265 bytes, 212, 106.
so that's the number you would want to use for size. for a destination, you're looking at trial and error. the ideal way obviously is to ping their servers, but that would be a bad thing, so do this instead. tracert atlas-east.vonage.net or atlas-west.vonage.net (depending if you're closer to east or west...not sure if there are any others) and look at your hops and route. (on another note, it's possible these servers are located in the same place, but they're setup for different halves of the US/world) it won't reach the server obviously, but you'll find out an approx number of hops and the backbone. I'll save you that step, it's alter.net. so find a server with about the same number of hops that eventually hits alter.net. preferably for the same amount of hops through alter.net, because obviously their servers are vital in this. (seems to be about about 6 or 7 through alter.net when you add the fact that the host is unreachable)
so really the hard part is finding a good host to trace/ping to. good luck.
thanks man. I apprciate the details.

LOL, Vonage tech told me to use 1200byte packett size REGARDLESS what bandwidth saver I use. Even though this goes agains pingplotter's recommendations of keeping it under 512bytes. Vonage tech's reasoning was b/c voice uses larger packets. Well, at 1200 get much, much more packet loss than say at 150 or 50.

BTW, I have gradually decreased my bandwidth setting from 90, to 50, now to 30 (since Aug/Sept 2004 since I had service) based on amt of dropped calls and garbled conversations.

Also, I am in the San Francisco area.

So far I am using Comcast.com figuring they are east coast based and I am hitting 6 alter.net hops. I'll try your suggestions tonight (if I last)...

thanks, Nike.
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