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Post new topic   Reply to topic  Vonage® VoIP Forum - Vonage News, Reviews And Discussion » Vonage UK
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NUTTER123
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Joined: Aug 25, 2006
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:29 am    Post subject: Vonage Fair Useage Policy? Reply with quote Back to top

****!

Got this email in my system:

Dear

From today 25 April 2008 to help ensure reliability and quality of the Vonage Service we have introduced a fair use policy. The fair use policy applies to all call plans. This policy does not affect the vast majority of our customers. For details please visit http://www.vonage.co.uk/features_terms_service.php
see sections 4.10 and 7 of Vonage terms of service.

Please do not reply to this email as the system is setup not to receive replies.

If you have any questions now or in the future Vonage Customer Care is eager to assist you from 8 a.m. to midnight, 7 days a week. Please visit our help centre at http://www.vonage.co.uk/help.php or send us an email from our Contact Us page at http://www.vonage.co.uk/help_contactUs.php You can also call us free by dialling 150 from your Vonage line or FreePhone 0800 008 6000 from other lines.

Sincerely
Vonage Customer Care
This message was sent from Vonage UK (www.vonage.co.uk) if you no longer want to receive our monthly newsletter, you can unsubscribe using the link below

To be removed click here:
http://app.icontact.com/icp/mmail-mprofile.pl?r=1052534510&l=156811&s=YMGO&m=30752356&c=110451

I checked the fair use limits and it appears:

Vonage Fair Usage Policy
If during any monthly billing cycle you exceed the fair usage limits set out below we may terminate your service immediately or, at our sole discretion if we consider it appropriate, we may suspend your service and offer you an alternative call plan applicable to your usage. If having offered you an alternative you do not agree to move to the new call plan we reserve the right to terminate your service immediately. Termination charges apply.

Fair Usage Limits
The following fair usage limits (with the exception of any specific call plans listed below) apply to all call plans, including those pre-dating the current version of this Fair Usage Policy.

The service is subject at all times to a limit of 2000 minutes in aggregate during each monthly billing cycle for outgoing inclusive calls to international countries specified in your call plan and for outgoing inclusive calls when calling UK landline numbers starting with 01, 02 and 03.

Calls included in your call plan have a maximum call duration of 4 hours per call, after which time the call will be disconnected.

Latest Version: 14th April, 2008
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richie79
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Joined: Apr 25, 2008
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:23 pm    Post subject: Distinctly unimpressed by this! Reply with quote Back to top

I just received this email and checked the TOS - 2000 mins basically equates to 33.333333 hours or in other words, less than an hour a day!!!

Now given that I specifically signed up to Vonage two years ago so that I can maintain a relationship with my American fiancee (also a Vonage user) until we can afford to get hitched and be together in the UK full-time I am distinctly unimpressed by this, since most months my calls to her come in at about 50-60 hrs.

Not only this, but according to the ToS, rather than just being billed extra or paying a penalty if you go over the 2000 mins limit on their 'unlimited' international phone service Vonage will immediately disconnect your line and take the final payment from your account - no ifs, buts or maybes Eek

After spending almost an hour on hold I spoke to Vonage customer services a few minutes ago and was told by the girl on the other end that the first they heard of this was when they began being deluged with calls from UK customers at about 5pm!

Coupled with the withdrawal of Maestro payments (which still I suspect has more to do with Maestro losing confidence in and hence withdrawing services from a company which by all accounts is in serious financial trouble and about to go under) I am seriously considering returning to POTS before it does and revert to Skype for international calls.

I guess Vonage really was too good to be true Sad
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NUTTER123
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Joined: Aug 25, 2006
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I'm in the same situation as you with an american fiance who I call virtually every night using Vonage (well did) I think Skype's 10000 minutes fair use is something I'll have to do too unfortunately.

Would you be charged if say the other person called your skype number? I know you get a free number included with a subscription but not sure if calls recieved cost you.

Seems that this has p***** a lot of people off going by what your saying.
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richie79
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:
Would you be charged if say the other person called your skype number? I know you get a free number included with a subscription but not sure if calls recieved cost you.


Unfortunately I don't know; as with Vonage we both downloaded the Skype program, but at that point I also had NTL home phone for my other calls and hence never actually paid a subscription or used prepaid minutes to skypeout. We only dumped Skype because the call quality was variable to put it mildly (especially at night, when we tend to talk) and because we wanted to cam simultaneously; it wouldn't play ball irrespective of which IM or webcam service we used.
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quails
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Page 1 of the Vonage UK website today carries the banner "No limits on calls", you go to the next level down on call plans and its still not mentioned.

An hour a day !!! Come off it, not being sexist, but do women in the US not talk like those in the UK ?

Just spoke to helpdesk, he sounded really down ! Apparently they've had this dropped on them without warning and they're getting inundated by calls from the UK - GOOD ! Oh pants, thats 10 minutes off my allowed usage for the day.
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ifd001
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Joined: Mar 30, 2005
Posts: 110

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 2:45 pm    Post subject: Unfair usage policy Reply with quote Back to top

I too got the email and straightaway emailed customer services, I too had done the calculation - that's about an hour a day. We don't have long american phone calls, but we do use the phone and certainly more than an hour a day.

I got an answer pretty quick:

"Thank you for choosing Vonage, the #1 rated digital phone service!

I understand that you are concerned about the introduction of our Fair Usage Policy.

The Fair Usage Policy has been introduced to UK customers to ensure that all customers are using our services for normal and reasonable purposes, and not anything contrary to the usage patterns they have subscribed to. The 2000 minute threshold was determined after checking the usage pattern of different customers.
"

What a load of rubbish.

That's an unfair usage policy.

Let's inundate customer services.

By the way send a PM to the MD of Vonage UK - jamesm on this forum.

Ian

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Ian
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NUTTER123
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Joined: Aug 25, 2006
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

If you want to cancel seems they slightly contradicting you?

If you do not want to continue the services with Vonage because of the introduction of the Fair Use Policy, you can disconnect the service without any disconnection or rebate recovery charges provided you have not used the Vonage service since we have informed about the change.

What's wrong with that you say? Well you will have to phone to cancel right? And if you do that would mean your using your Vonage line right? (unless you use another line but some of us can't do that) and if you use the line they slap fees on you for using the Vonage line to cancel? even if you phoned to cancel in the first place?
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bigsister
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:26 pm    Post subject: fair use? Reply with quote Back to top

It seems a bit of a contradiction offering an "unlimited calls" plan, but then adding a Fair Use Policy which determines how "unlimited" your calls are. If you are only allowed to make a limit of 2000 minutes, then they are not offering an "unlimited call plan", rather a "2000 mins free" call plan. Doesnt this come under false advertising? By all means Vonage can change their ToS, but as far as I remeber :

unlimited:
1. not limited; unrestricted; unconfined: unlimited trade.
2. boundless; infinite; vast: the unlimited skies.
3. without any qualification or exception; unconditional.

So arent we now paying for a free inclusive mins call plan, rather than an unlimited one? This has got to be false advertising, from the very point that they are using the words "unlimited calls"?
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Cherimoya
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Joined: Jan 15, 2006
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I'm in the same situation as Nutter and Richie (didn't realise there were so many of us Cool and I think this really blows.

Unfortunately I think it may be moot soon because the whole tone of the changes smacks of the last desperate thrashings of a dying beast. I mean who is going to sign up to an unlimited plan of 2000 minutes? I get more than that on my cellphone Eek

I think Vonage will soon be no more
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richie79
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I emailed them earlier (see below) and like ifd001 got a standard form letter in response that completely failed to address any of the points I raised.

I fully intend to contact BBC Watchdog to see if they can get some sort of clarification out of the company where everyone else has failed, but as Cherimoya points out I suspect that it's probably time to start looking for an alternative Voip provider as Vonage's days are almost certainly numbered. The tragedy being that when you compare what the likes of BT and Virgin are offering, with extra charges for pretty much everything, this service would be fantastic value even if it were twice the cost. I have a feeling this all goes back to the legal problems with Verizon in the US and that the UK arm of the operation is just a victim of circumstances beyond its control.

____________________________________________________________

Dear Sir / Madam,

As a UK customer I received an email earlier today informing me of the introduction of a 'fair usage' policy for international call-plan users. I expected this to be set at a reasonable level; however on closer examination I realised that the new limit of 2000 minutes actually equates to a little over an hour a day. I specifically ordered the Vonage service to allow me to stay in touch with my fiancee, another Vonage subscriber who lives in the US. Being so far apart and only able to visit one another for short periods we frequently talk for more than an hour a day - and this policy will seriously impact on our relationship.

I am disappointed that your website and advertising was still (as of 9pm) advertising the service as 'unlimited' international and UK telephony with 'no limits on calls' when it is quite clear that this is no longer the case. I am horrified that the 'Vonage-to-Vonage' section of your site is still claiming that you can 'talk as long as you like' when that has not been so since April 14th. I am dismayed that as with the recent move to credit card-only payments you have chosen to betray the goodwill of your UK subscribers (especially since, from what I can gather, these measures are limited to the UK only). And I am frankly fuming that Vonage sees fit to treat its loyal users in this manner with very little offered by way of explanation.

Until recently I was a true devotee of your service. I was happy to recommend it to others and rave about the free features and low costs. I am now seriously considering cancelling a product which will no longer serve my needs and which will soon become vastly inferior to that I signed up for with no corresponding reduction in price. I appreciate that the service as previously offered was very good value and would even be willing to pay a modest increase in order to continue my present rate of usage, but the wording of the fair usage policy seems to suggest that this is not to be offered as an option.

I am also annoyed that despite various calls to Vonage customer services, none of the operatives appeared to have been briefed on these changes and seemed as surprised at the sudden deluge of UK calls as I was to receive the notification email in my inbox. No-one I spoke to was able to advise me whether calls from a Vonage line to another, international Vonage user were included in this policy. I appreciate that this is probably not due to a failing on the part of the staff I contacted but a catastrophic breakdown of communications between the frontline staff and management.

I am extremely disappointed at the distinctly UNfair conduct of Vonage UK in this matter, and should I not receive a satisfactory reply to my points (I didn't spend twenty minutes writing an email to illicit the usual standard reply from an automated server) I shall be contacting Trading Standards and the BBC's 'Watchdog' programme at the earliest opportunity.

Many thanks,

Richard Edwards
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1Unlimited calling and other services for all residential plans are based on normal residential, personal, non-commercial use. A combination of factors is used to determine abnormal use, including but not limited to: the number of unique numbers called, calls forwarded, minutes used and other factors. Subject to our Reasonable Use Policy and Terms of Service.

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