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gomo
Vonage Forum Associate
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Joined: May 22, 2006
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

move this crap talk to another thread(we know all this already), this is about the buyback talk and related info.
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maryjane
Vonage Forum Evangelist
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Joined: Dec 22, 2005
Posts: 409
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

trillian wrote:
It was a penalty imposed as part of a plea-bargain. But let's refresh ourselves of the facts:-

Quote:
Instead of using SOES for its lawful purpose -- to execute trades on behalf of individual investors -- defendants Sheldon Maschler, Citron, McCarty, and Erik Maschler engaged in a massive fraudulent scheme to execute millions of proprietary trades on the SOES system. From 1995 through March 1998, Datek Securities executed approximately 12 million SOES trades, over 30 percent of all SOES trades.

To hide their proprietary trading, defendants Sheldon Maschler, Citron, McCarty, and Erik Maschler established dozens of nominee accounts, and paid nominees a guaranteed and fixed rate of return in exchange for the use of their identities and complete discretionary trading authority.

From 1993 to 1994, at the direction of Sheldon Maschler, Citron, McCarty, and Erik Maschler, Datek Securities employees manually allocated Datek Securities' trades among accounts after the close of the market. Beginning in early 1994, the unlawful allocation process was automated and carried out through a sophisticated software program developed for the firm and known as "Wire." Wire dramatically enhanced defendants' ability to conceal their proprietary SOES trading. The software was ultimately refined to allocate trades among nominee customer accounts as the trades occurred.


http://ftp.sec.gov/litigation/litreleases/lr17929.htm

That's the man running your company.

Quote:
It was a simple SEC civil penalty


Well, if you like. But I would bear in mind the facts of the entire case as listed above by official source.



None of those facts that you have inserted were hidden from anyone, For pete's sake there in the Vonage Prospectus. On Page 16 !

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gfoulks
Vonage Forum Master
Vonage Forum Master


Joined: Jan 18, 2004
Posts: 243

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

gomo wrote:
move this crap talk to another thread(we know all this already), this is about the buyback talk and related info.


I agree! Anyone who invested in this company knew about all of this because we did what we were suppose to do and read the prospectus. The issue in this thread is about the buy back.

My question is... how is this fair to those who paid their obligation and is this even legal to do?
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oz_80
Vonage Forum Junior
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Joined: May 08, 2006
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

SEC has been unhappy with Vonage founder Jeff Citron over a previous alleged stock scam.


But I think Michael F. Snyder is the CEO now and Citron has title of "chief strategist", whatever that means.
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gfoulks
Vonage Forum Master
Vonage Forum Master


Joined: Jan 18, 2004
Posts: 243

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I have a feeling that something major is about break as it relates to this story.

I just received an email from a Senior Vice President of Smith Barney, Mark D. Evans. His reply to my questions about the buy back and he says.

"This is a rumor"

CNBC wouldn't report something if it didn't have credible sources. He further said,

"The company has not made any official announcements as of yet. We will let you know if they do"

Sounds like someone spoke before they were suppose to and now everyone is in CYA mode.

It'll be interesting to see what happens over the next couple of days.
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chiefwes
Vonage Forum Associate
Vonage Forum Associate


Joined: Feb 14, 2006
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

dconnor wrote:
trillian wrote:
Quote:
Is that way it sold for 1.3 billion?


After they had kicked out Jeffry Citron, who, following his fraud conviction, then went to run........ Vonage.

You can completely understand the concern, although I presume that investors in Vonage did know about Citron's previous convictions and life ban from dealings with Stock Exchange brokers.


You use the word "fraud conviction" loosely.
I do not recall this ever happening.

It was a simple SEC civil penalty


dconner, i know you run the forum and love Vonage, but please do not let your love for Vonage cloud the facts. evryone already knows citron is a fraudster, so this is not new news. anyone entering into this IPO knew of his past and knew that he may not have the best interest of the little people in mind. you all knew he was a snake when you picked up the stock, so do not be surprised if you get bit.

now, back to this buy back....does ANYONE have concrete evidence on this matter?
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gfoulks
Vonage Forum Master
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Joined: Jan 18, 2004
Posts: 243

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Only what was reported by CNBC this morning on SquawkBox
http://spaces.msn.com/squawkblog/

Smith Barney said that the company has not made an offical announcement as of yet.
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ShelChgo
Vonage Forum Senior
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Joined: Feb 27, 2006
Posts: 81

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reality Check Reply with quote Back to top

* IF you had known you had the stock allocated, you still would have lost money.

*Citron's past problems were well documented in the press and in the prospectus. Plus his past issues do not automatically mean he's taking similar actions now.

*The Vonage IPO web site was never represented as a real time trading platform. Delays in postings would be expected.

* If you believed the company was worth $17 a share at the IPO, why aren't you all buying now at $12.68 and averaging down you costs?

* The only reason that Vonage will take ANY action is not because there was any wrong doing, but because CUSTOMERS are feeling burned and they can't afford any more customer losses.

This is what happens when you play the market on hype and not do your own research.
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LDTalk
Vonage Forum Senior
Vonage Forum Senior


Joined: May 24, 2006
Posts: 80

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 2:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Vonage to buy back shares for those not willing to pay. Reply with quote Back to top

gfoulks wrote:
Heard this morning on CNBC that for Select customers who chose not to pay for the shares they asked for Vonage is going to buy those shares back from the customer.

So if you broke the rules your rewarded with a $17 buyback while those that played by the rules are getting punished with with a $12 stock and huge losses?


I see that this is not confirmed as of yet. However, if this information turns out to be true, I think Vonage will be in for even more trouble...

It goes without saying that everyone who bought shares in the IPO would love to sell those shares back at $17/share at this time.

However, rewarding those who broke the agreement by refusing to pay, will essentially punish all the honest investors who took their loss and submitted payment for their shares.

It will be interesting to see what happens...

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gfoulks
Vonage Forum Master
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Joined: Jan 18, 2004
Posts: 243

PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

It is a no win situation for Vonage.

If they buy back the shares of those who don't pay... well then you upset the people who did the right thing by paying for their obligation and who are now in the red and will likely never be whole again. This creates the potential of losing more customers.

If they sue the ones that didn't pay then you upset a large number of people and lose even more customers which Vonage can not afford right now.

All of this is bad press which will likely turn alot of potential customers away.

Then of course the press is also working against Vonage because each time you hear Vonage in the news it is soon followed with the name of a competitor which is giving them free advertising.


The only logical solution for Vonage and the underwriters to save face is to rescind the IPO and try to forget that this bad dream ever happened.
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