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medic7
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2006 1:00 pm    Post subject: Partyline on My Phone Line VOIP? Reply with quote Back to top

We've had Vonage for around 3 years now. Yesterday was the fourth time myself and others here had it happen, where another party is on line. It's a wired phone, not a wireless.

Example: yesterday I got a call in the afternoon. I picked up saying "Hello" and started talking to my friend. Then a woman picked up and said "hello, hello who is there" and I asked who this was and she said "who is this" and then she hung up. My friend had no other party on his end as he was at home with no other phoneline.

The first this ever happened I picked up the phone (again all Vonage) to make a call and two woman were talking. I listened (didn't know what to say or do as I was so surprised). Then after a minute I got my dialtone.

Other family have had the same things happen, but nothing on a regular basis. It's almost like those old fashioned partylines where neighbors would share a single phone line.

I'm going to call Vonage, but last time I did on this I was put through to tech support and was on hold forever and didn't have the time to stay on hold much longer.

Vonage is a 2nd phone in the house, but it bothers me that someone could be listening in as it appears there is no way to tell.

Any ideas on this? Has it happened to others?
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NateHoy
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2006 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

That's a new one on me. I've heard of it happening, but never had it happen to me.

I run WallWatcher most of the time on my router, so if it ever did happen to me I'd have detailed logs of what IP address and port my Vonage device was connected to. But, since it never has, there's not much I can offer in terms of data.

_________________
Comcast Cable (3m down / 256k up) -> Linksys BEFCMU10 v2 (DOCSIS 1.0) -> WRT54G v4 ("Tomato" firmware) -> the rest of my network including a WRTP54G (Firmware: 5.01.04)
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VonageTPA
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2006 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:
"The first this ever happened I picked up the phone (again all Vonage) to make a call and two woman were talking. I listened (didn't know what to say or do as I was so surprised). Then after a minute I got my dialtone. "


With the way SIP & the Vonage adapters work, this type of thing usually can't happen. I say usually because anything's possible. Do you have Vonage connected to your house's wiring or just a phone plugged straight into it? If the former, go outside & make sure you've totally disconnected your lines from the phone co's.

_________________
ISP: Varies depending where I'm at.
Vonage: Linksys RTP300
Router: IPCop 1.4.10
Phones: various
Total calls since Jul 24, 2005: 4,794 calls
Total Minutes since Jul 24, 2005: 25,552 minutes
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NHTracker
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 2:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

It's also happened to me in the past. Picked up the phone,dialed, and low and behold some random people chatting on my line briefly before dissapearing
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bg4
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 7:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Happened on our line last weekend (4/29 or 4/30) I call home from work and wife starts asakinh who else is on the line. Later she tells me we had a party line. Never happened again.

It does happen. Go figure.

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Bob-Long Island NY
Vonage Customer since August 8, 2005
ISP: Optimum Online
Router Motorola VT2442
Setup: SB4200>VT2442>Linksys WRT54G v2.2 (running WRT) wifi enabled-port 1 to switch>two PC's-
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medic7
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

The line is individual. As in it's a wire phone that plugs right into the Links Router from Vonage and that plugs into the Cable modem and the cable modem goes to the cable wire.

I called Vonage yesterday and they put me through to a "level 2" tech person who was very hard to understand (indian or something) and he put switched it to "Line 2" and said to switch the wire to line 2. And he said that "should help, but if not call back." He had no explanation other than wires being crossed. So far it's been good.

Can anyone say how if the people I heard were local (near us) or across the country or world?

Can anyone give a technical reason how/why this happens?
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NateHoy
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

The only technical reason I can think of is that both RTP connections were made to the same Vonage server on the same port.

Vonage places RTP servers around the country. When you pick up your phone, or when you get an incoming call, the Vonage device sends a signal over Session Initiation Protocol (port 5060 or 5061) which basically says, "Hey, Vonage server, what RTP server and port should I connect to for this call?"

By default, Vonage uses one of a series of servers to connect you to, and assigns a random port between 10,000 and 20,000.

How the SIP server knows you freed up the port, I don't know. But I suppose it is possible that someone else's call is also attached to that same port on that same RTP server, and since RTP is basic unverified UTP transfer, anything sent to that port would be sent to anyone the main server told to send it to.

So, basically, it sounds like there is an overloaded RTP server, or one that isn't properly checking to make sure a port is freed up before it gives it to a new call.

_________________
Comcast Cable (3m down / 256k up) -> Linksys BEFCMU10 v2 (DOCSIS 1.0) -> WRT54G v4 ("Tomato" firmware) -> the rest of my network including a WRTP54G (Firmware: 5.01.04)
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VonageTPA
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Hmm.. you've got me stumped... I doubt switching ports on the adapter will make a difference. (Can anyone tell me why Vonage techs love doing this? Has it ever solved any real issues other than a blown port?)

With the way that Voip works, it's very difficult (as in, I can't think of a way if everything works as the specs say) to get the bits going to the wrong adapter. The only possible areas that can cause this problem will be on Vonage's side, either on their proxy servers, which might be getting overworked and confuses the bits, slapping a wrong header on them which is like a mailing/address label, or that it's a problem on their interface to the PSTN (public switched telephone network).

What makes your problem most interesting is that you said the voices were there when you picked up the phone, which seems VERY inconsistent with how these devices are supposed to work.

_________________
ISP: Varies depending where I'm at.
Vonage: Linksys RTP300
Router: IPCop 1.4.10
Phones: various
Total calls since Jul 24, 2005: 4,794 calls
Total Minutes since Jul 24, 2005: 25,552 minutes
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NateHoy
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

VonageTPA -

SIP/RTP is like DHCP. It must have some sort of a lease renewal to ensure that terminated ports free up. What if the Vonage device, for whatever reason, did not respond to the lease renewal request, or did not properly send that request?

In that case, the SIP server would naturally assume that the RTP port (like an IP address for DHCP) is freed up once the lease expires, and would allocate that IP address out to another client.

That, despite the fact that the RTP port may still be in use, from a client that has not properly requested a lease renewal (like a cached IP address on a DHCP client).

Of course, the problem could, as you say, be in the PSTN bridge, for much the same reason - switching to a line that it thinks is available but really isn't. But I would think a simple voltage check would control that.

In any case, I agree - there is no way the user's Vonage adapter is causing this. This is a server-side issue.

_________________
Comcast Cable (3m down / 256k up) -> Linksys BEFCMU10 v2 (DOCSIS 1.0) -> WRT54G v4 ("Tomato" firmware) -> the rest of my network including a WRTP54G (Firmware: 5.01.04)
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VonageTPA
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I'm aware of how SIP works; the part which gets me is that the OP picked up the phone and there was already a voice conversation going on... I don't think the problem is the adapter as it has no other audio source, BUT, how does an adapter process a call when it's on-hook -- it shouldn't. I have seen Vonage's proxies go nuts and not disconnect a call and keep sending packets...but even when that was happening, as long as the line back on-hook, the adapter terminated the call & gave a fresh dialtone when I go off-hook again. I'm sure there's a proxy or PSTN connection to blame for the problem, but I keep getting caught up on the voice-before-dialtone...which really doesn't sound right.

As far as the PSTN connection goes, I'm sure these are handled digitally via PRIs, T1s, etc. FAR cheaper to bring in large numbers of voice lines (channels) this way than individual analog lines.

_________________
ISP: Varies depending where I'm at.
Vonage: Linksys RTP300
Router: IPCop 1.4.10
Phones: various
Total calls since Jul 24, 2005: 4,794 calls
Total Minutes since Jul 24, 2005: 25,552 minutes
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