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rnclem
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Joined: May 02, 2005
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 7:15 pm    Post subject: Re-using router for another new Vonage subscriber-BIG-NO-NO! Reply with quote Back to top

Well Vonage has finally frosted my cookies. I have had it and I have been a customer for several years. I upgraded my router a while back and decided to go ahead and sell the Linksys RT31P2 so that someone else could get Vonage service. Well when my friend tried to have Vonage service turned up he was told by Vonage that that router was and only could be assigned to me. I called Vonage and asked them to please release the MAC address from my account and let my friend start a new account. Vonage just said flat out that they could not do that. So rather than have anther happy customer Vonage decided that they would lose a good customer and never get that other new customer. Now that is customer service for you. This is not a technology issue - this is just a way to sell more hardware as far as I am concerned.

Well Vonage you did me wrong for the last time so I will say so long and I will tell the world about how bad I was treated and bad your customer service is. I guess that this reflects from the Top Down of a company.
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UMP25
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Joined: Feb 09, 2006
Posts: 276

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Truthfully, this is just one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. Makes me wonder just how "new, unused" all those Vonage adapters on ebay are.

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reebok
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Joined: Oct 24, 2004
Posts: 3198
Location: Lakeland, FL

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

unfortunately this seems to be hit or miss, with more misses than hits. but people have definitely reused Vonage routers (or so they say on this forum)

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JoeO
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Joined: Feb 25, 2006
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

I was told the same thing when I ordered...because I questioned using my OWN device.

They said that the device could only be used for my account.
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riddler
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Joined: Dec 18, 2005
Posts: 83
Location: Tennessee

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Let me get this straight...My RTP300 can be used by me and only me forever?.....
If I had known that I would like to have picked the colors and shape and maybe even give it a name before I got it...

Guess I didnt read the prenuptial agreement close enough...
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maryjane
Vonage Forum Evangelist
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Joined: Dec 22, 2005
Posts: 409
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

2.2 Residential Use of Service and Device. If you subscribe to Vonage's residential services, the Service and the Device are provided to you solely for residential use. You shall not resell or transfer the Service or the Device to another party without our prior written consent. You are prohibited from using the Service or the Device for auto-dialing, continuous or extensive call forwarding, telemarketing (including, without limitation, charitable or political solicitation or polling), fax or voicemail broadcasting or fax or voicemail blasting. We reserve the right to immediately terminate or modify your Service if we determine, in our sole and absolute discretion, that your use of the Service or the Device is, or at any time was, inconsistent with normal residential usage patterns. In addition, you will be required to pay our higher rates for commercial service for all periods in which your use of the Service or the Device was inconsistent with normal residential use.

Has anyone ever tried to get the written consent? If so did it work out ok??

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Router..........Linksys RTP300 FV1.00.60
Modem.........Motorola SB5100
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DallasFlier
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Joined: Mar 03, 2005
Posts: 277
Location: Dallas, TX

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 2:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

maryjane wrote:


Has anyone ever tried to get the written consent? If so did it work out ok??

No, but no court would ever uphold the requirement for you to get that written consent. Here's what they try to claim:

2.2 Residential Use of Service and Device. If you subscribe to Vonage's residential services, the Service and the Device are provided to you solely for residential use. You shall not resell or transfer the Service or the Device to another party without our prior written consent. You are prohibited from using the Service or the Device for auto-dialing, continuous or extensive call forwarding, telemarketing (including, without limitation, charitable or political solicitation or polling), fax or voicemail broadcasting or fax or voicemail blasting. We reserve the right to immediately terminate or modify your Service if we determine, in our sole and absolute discretion, that your use of the Service or the Device is, or at any time was, inconsistent with normal residential usage patterns. In addition, you will be required to pay our higher rates for commercial service for all periods in which your use of the Service or the Device was inconsistent with normal residential use.

2.13 Ownership and Risk of Loss. You will own the Device and bear all risk of loss of, theft of, casualty to or damage to the Device, from the time it is shipped to you until the time (if any) when it is returned to us in accordance with this Agreement.

2.10 Return of Device (Does Not Apply to Business Plus Customers)
Retail Customers. A Retail Customer may only return the Device to the retail store, dealer or other provider from which the Retail Customer purchased the Device. All returns will be subject to the return policy of such retail store, dealer or other provider. We will not accept any Device returned to us from a Retail Customer. Vonage will credit services fees if you call us within the Money Back Guarantee period.
(b) Non-Retail Customers. Non-Retail Customers may return the Device to us if 1) you cancel services within the Money Back Guarantee period and 2) you return the Device to us within fourteen (14) days of the date you terminated Service. Vonage will also waive our $39.99 termination fee subject to the following.

2.1 (a) Monthly Term. Service is offered on a monthly basis for a term that begins on the date that Vonage activates your Service and ends on the day before the same date in the following month. Subsequent terms of this Agreement automatically renew on a monthly basis unless you give us written notice of non-renewal at least ten (10) days before the end of the monthly term in which the notice is given. You are purchasing the Service for full monthly terms, meaning that if you attempt to terminate Service prior to the end of a monthly term, you will be responsible for the full month's charges to the end of the then-current term, including, without limitation, unbilled charges, plus a termination fee, if applicable, all of which will immediately become due and payable. You will also be responsible for the next full month's charges in the event that you do not provide the requisite ten-day notice of termination prior to the expiration of the then-current term. Expiration of the term or termination of Service will not excuse you from paying all accrued and unpaid charges due under this Agreement. Notwithstanding the foregoing, if you terminate Vonage service after the Money Back Guarantee period, but within the first twelve months, Vonage charges a termination fee of $39.99 per line.

This agreement in whole would be a laughing stock if ever tested in court, but of course the value of the adapter isn't enough to be worth hiring an attorney and filing suit. Summarizing, here's what they say:

* YOU own the device, and bear all risk of loss or damage.

* Although YOU own the device, Vonage forbids you from reselling or transferring YOUR property to another party without THEIR prior written consent. (Those two provisions combined constitute the real ridiculous and unenforcable part of the agreement.)

* If you cancel service within the first year, Vonage will charge you a $39.99 cancellation fee. Although YOU own the device, if you cancel within that first year, you may choose to give them YOUR device in lieu of that cancellation fee.

Of course, they can make it difficult or impossible for anyone else to activate the device on their network, and also difficult or impossible to unlock the device to use elsewhere. So, they can't enforce their Terms of Service agreement, but they are in effect making the devices worthless to the owner.

Again, not worth hiring a lawyer about, but I wonder what would happen if subscribers started filing small claims court cases and making them show up in the local court to defend the case? I believe I can file a small claims complaint here for about a $20 filing fee, its designed to not need a lawyer, and their legal team would be forced to come defend the case, or at a minimum to spend time filing an answer with the court asking that it be thrown out - and if I entered into the agreement here, I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think their insistence of New Jersey venue will hold - but even if it does they still have to respond to the filing and ask that it be quashed because of their insistence on NJ venue.

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TWC 20M/2M w/Moto DOCSIS 3 --> WRT54G v2 (Tomato F/W) --> 4 PC's, 2 wireless; 4 networked DirecTV boxes; PS3 (powerline wired) & Wii (wireless) VT2442 (routing OFF), RTP300 (routing OFF) & V-Portal - Total of 4 Vonage lines
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maryjane
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Joined: Dec 22, 2005
Posts: 409
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

Isn't written consent as simple as writing a letter to Vonage for permission and waiting on a consent letter?

**note: this is of course AFTER you have waited the years time and now own it.

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ISP...............Comcast
Voip..............Vonage
Router..........Linksys RTP300 FV1.00.60
Modem.........Motorola SB5100
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riddler
Vonage Forum Senior
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Joined: Dec 18, 2005
Posts: 83
Location: Tennessee

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

When/If you get a reply,Im sure the years time would be up..
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DallasFlier
Vonage Forum Master
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Joined: Mar 03, 2005
Posts: 277
Location: Dallas, TX

PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Back to top

maryjane wrote:
Isn't written consent as simple as writing a letter to Vonage for permission and waiting on a consent letter?

As "simple", you say??? I think it will be a cold day in hades before anyone ever sees such a letter from Vonage.

maryjane wrote:
**note: this is of course AFTER you have waited the years time and now own it.

Uhh, you own it from day one, no waiting required. Its just that although you own it, they claim they can tell you whether or not you can sell or give it away.

Quote:
2.13 Ownership and Risk of Loss. You will own the Device and bear all risk of loss of, theft of, casualty to or damage to the Device, from the time it is shipped to you until the time (if any) when it is returned to us in accordance with this Agreement.

_________________
TWC 20M/2M w/Moto DOCSIS 3 --> WRT54G v2 (Tomato F/W) --> 4 PC's, 2 wireless; 4 networked DirecTV boxes; PS3 (powerline wired) & Wii (wireless) VT2442 (routing OFF), RTP300 (routing OFF) & V-Portal - Total of 4 Vonage lines
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1Unlimited calling and other services for all residential plans are based on normal residential, personal, non-commercial use. A combination of factors is used to determine abnormal use, including but not limited to: the number of unique numbers called, calls forwarded, minutes used and other factors. Subject to our Reasonable Use Policy and Terms of Service.

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