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Vonage Hey GardRailz, you got someone to pay for the CISSP class - get them to pay for the



Hey GardRailz, you got someone to pay for the CISSP class - get them to pay for the test so you can add the letters to your name :) The real pain is getting them to pay for enough training each year to accumulate the continuing professional education credits (CPEs) to maintain the certification once you have it... that's my current problem. PM me if you want to talk about the CISSP &etc.

Seconding much of GardRailz's excellent statements ("it doesn't justify opening up another opportunity .. because you can get the information from other sources"), and answering Michael545's concern (or lack of concern) about credit card theft through Voip - yes, there are easier ways to steal individual credit card numbers (mailboxes on the street, though this works only a few times per year per mailbox; get a job as a waitron for a few weeks which provides a pretty steady stream of credit card numbers), however these mechanisms have a higher risk of getting caught (neighborhood watch associations looking for people sticking their hands in to your mailbox, the restaurant staff noticing that you're scribbling down something from receipts). A compromised router in line with a business' Voip traffic, accessed through a trojaned network of home PCs, simply won't get personal even if it is detected because it doesn't leave enough of an audit trail (those trojaned PC networks are a real bane of investigators' existence, as are trans-national investigations), and allows the criminal (because we really are talking about criminals here, not script kiddiez) to safely gather massive volumes of information, chew on it until it's all boiled down and financially useful to the criminal and his customers, and all at once cause a large financial loss.

To Michael545's suggestion that the MAC "authentication" used by Vonage's servers would provide useful protection against theft of a single Vonage customer's phone service (at any one moment), a denial of service targeted against an adaptor would be quite effective at preventing it from taking up its rightful spot in Vonage's servers' authentication tables. This would of course result in a noticed service outage for the legitimate customer, so the attacker would just need to go after a different Vonage adaptor when the first victim comes home and wants to use the phone... These issues are largely the same as normal IP address spoofing, and standard script-kiddie capable tools unfortunately already do exist for that.

Finally, to Michael545's point about credit card company greed and the suggestion that the fees would not go down even if we magically eliminated all fraud, I have to pin my hopes on good old fashioned capitalism and competition, driven by that very same greed (to have the most customers) - if the real costs of the credit card companies did go down, it only takes the first greedy company dropping its fees 1% in order to gain more customers, to cause the whole industry to have to follow suit. I hope :)

Finally, putting real security in to this system is not very hard and is not even very expensive. Some of the mechanisms are already standardized. Others are only a matter of time, and interim steps could be taken by a greedy company which wants to differentiate itself from the rest of the field. That makes it all the more irresponsible of the Voip providers to not do it. It's a good sign that the VOIPSA formed recently. I hope they move faster than some other such bodies have over the years.

Cheers!
-Jay Libove, CISSP
Atlanta, GA, US



Read The Full Thread:

Security: Lack of response from customercare...


What's the procedure to cancel the service, just call the main number and say i
Anyone taking the time and energy to rebuild and listen to my conversations is
That's where you're mistaken, if vonage is your only service, or you mistakenly
Like I said. While this may be a concern for you, anyone that expends the time and
Maybe Maxwell Smart could loan you "The Cone Of Silence" :-D Seriously, if security
True, and I'd be willing to pay more money. The thing that really pisses me off is
As far as I know it is secure...You have SIP which initiates the call and then RTP
:twisted: I'm busily surrounding my house with lead and searching for hidden
If you'd like, i can provide a step by step demonstration of how easy it is utilizing
If you'd like, I can take you to the cross-box and show you how to put your butt-set

libove posted "Hey GardRailz, you got someone to pay for the CISSP class - get them to pay for the" on 04/25/2005

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1Unlimited calling and other services for all residential plans are based on normal residential, personal, non-commercial use. A combination of factors is used to determine abnormal use, including but not limited to: the number of unique numbers called, calls forwarded, minutes used and other factors. Subject to our Reasonable Use Policy and Terms of Service.

2Shipping and activation fees waived with 1-year agreement. An Early Termination Fee (with periodic pro-rated reductions) applies if service is terminated before the end of the first 12 months. Additional restrictions may apply. See Terms of Service for details.

HIGH SPEED INTERNET REQUIRED. †VALID FOR NEW LINES ONLY. RATES EXCLUDE INTERNET SERVICE, SURCHARGES, FEES AND TAXES. DEVICE MAY BE REFURBISHED. If you subscribe to plans with monthly minutes allotments, all call minutes placed from both from your home and registered ExtensionsTM phones will count toward your monthly minutes allotment. ExtensionsTM calls made from mobiles use airtime and may incur surcharges, depending on your mobile plan. Alarms, TTY and other systems may not be compatible. Vonage 911 service operates differently than traditional 911. See www.vonage.com/911 for details.

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